<VV> VirtualVairs Digest, Vol 79, Issue 97
Jerry Brown
air_cooled63 at yahoo.com
Wed Aug 31 20:01:32 EDT 2011
I am working on a 1962 Corvair and I just removed the engine and transmission. Taking look at the heater plenum it appears very rusty. I have never removed a heater box and it appears that the rear suspension needs to be removed before the heater box can be changed. Am I correct or is there a short cut in replacing the box with out removing the suspension. I started to remove the bolts for the suspension but the forward bolt heads were rusted and the 6 point socket stripped the bolt head. I may have to torch the bolt heads off.
Jerry
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Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 8:16 AM
Subject: VirtualVairs Digest, Vol 79, Issue 97
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Problems with a 140 tear down (Bob Gilbert)
2. Problems with a 140 tear down (kevin nash)
3. Re: KEYS (Sethracer at aol.com)
4. Re: FW: corvair carburetors - pump cups (Sethracer at aol.com)
5. Replacement Blocks & engines (Sethracer at aol.com)
6. viton pump cups (J R Read)
7. Re: FROZEN MOTORs (N2VZD at aol.com)
8. Re: WTB: '65 FC (Greenbrier) 110 Block (Mikeamauro at aol.com)
9. Re: Prayers Needed (Jay Pitchford)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 20:01:41 -0700
From: "Bob Gilbert" <bgilbert at gilberts-bc.ca>
Subject: Re: <VV> Problems with a 140 tear down
To: "'J R Read'" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>, <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
Message-ID: <01a201cc678a$4edd8570$ec989050$@gilberts-bc.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
JR,
I was thinking of something similar by way of an old metal pan filled with
diesel oil and leave the entire thing, plugs out, sit in it for a week.
Somebody told me diesel oil might do the trick.
Regards,
Bob
Ps but the dynamite might be more exciting! :-)
-----Original Message-----
From: J R Read [mailto:hmlinc at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: August-30-11 7:30 PM
To: Bob Gilbert; virtualvairs at corvair.org
Subject: Re: <VV> Problems with a 140 tear down
Patience instead of dynamite.
If it's on a stand which (I assume) rotates - try putting the engine
90degrees from normal and pull the plugs on the high side. Put plenty of
Marvel Mystery Oil (or your favorite concoction) into those 3. After a week
(maybe 2), put those plugs in and do the same on the other side. Give it a
couple more weeks on that side and put it level. Pull, or at least greatly
loosen the plugs and begin working the crank back and forth until you can
work it to the point where it will go a full 360. This could happen right
away - or (more likely) take another couple of weeks with say 3 or 4 10
minute tries each day. Eventually, you should be able to get to all of the
rod cap nuts.
Later, JR
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Gilbert" <bgilbert at gilberts-bc.ca>
To: <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 8:51 PM
Subject: <VV> Problems with a 140 tear down
> Hi,
>
> I'm in the process of tearing down a 140 block as a pre-cursor to starting
> the 3.1 build for my UltraVan. The block and everything inside and outside
> were very, very rusty. Other than making it a tougher job to tear down , I
> didn't worry too much about the rust as most of what is rusty will be
> replaced or otherwise worked on.
>
>
>
> Until now!
>
>
>
> I've removed the heads and I am down to the bare crankcase and cylinders
> with pistons in them. The bell housing is still attached and is mounted to
> my engine stand.
>
>
>
> The problem is the crank won't move (possibly even rusted by itself) and
> the pistons are rust-welded to the cylinders! So I can't even get to the
> all
> of the con rod bolts off and split the case.
>
>
>
> Any ideas? (besides dynamite!)
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> the property
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------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 20:29:10 -0700
From: kevin nash <wrokit at hotmail.com>
Subject: <VV> Problems with a 140 tear down
To: "virtualvairs at corvair.org" <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
Message-ID: <BAY148-W24786AAB49484CD88F9938D3160 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> Message: 5
> Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 18:51:17 -0700
> From: "Bob Gilbert" <bgilbert at gilberts-bc.ca>
> Subject: <VV> Problems with a 140 tear down
> To: <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Message-ID: <018c01cc6780$794c2550$6be46ff0$@gilberts-bc.ca>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm in the process of tearing down a 140 block as a pre-cursor to starting
> the 3.1 build for my UltraVan. The block and everything inside and outside
> were very, very rusty. Other than making it a tougher job to tear down , I
> didn't worry too much about the rust as most of what is rusty will be
> replaced or otherwise worked on.
>
>
>
> Until now!
>
>
>
> I've removed the heads and I am down to the bare crankcase and cylinders
> with pistons in them. The bell housing is still attached and is mounted to
> my engine stand.
>
>
>
> The problem is the crank won't move (possibly even rusted by itself) and
> the pistons are rust-welded to the cylinders! So I can't even get to the all
> of the con rod bolts off and split the case.
>
>
>
> Any ideas? (besides dynamite!)
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob
>
Bob- I had the same problem getting a early turbo engine apart- I used 2 or 3 cans of pb blaster on it makingsure to hose down everything that could possibly be frozen, including the base of the cylinders. After each spray downsession, I lightly tapped the pistions and barrels with a hammer- the ringing from the hammer taps helps the oil seepinto the stuck parts. After a couple of weeks of spraying and banging (NEVER hitting anything hard enough to dent orchip anything) the cylinders finally un-stuck them selves from the block, and was able to remove the rods. If you trythis, remember, its the ringing of the metal that does the work, not the force of the hit!Kevin Nash
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 23:53:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: Sethracer at aol.com
Subject: Re: <VV> KEYS
To: N2VZD at aol.com, virtualvairs at corvair.org
Message-ID: <15060.6d8857b8.3b8f0a3b at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
In a message dated 8/30/2011 4:12:06 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
N2VZD at aol.com writes:
i save all GM lock parts from corvairs , and speedo parts. they are
getting tougher to find .
regards, Tim Colson
Tim - Then I suggest you save them someplace where they are easier to
find! <grin> -Seth
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2011 00:03:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: Sethracer at aol.com
Subject: Re: <VV> FW: corvair carburetors - pump cups
To: hmlinc at sbcglobal.net, dpleau at wavecable.com,
virtualvairs at corvair.org
Message-ID: <15384.5f31810d.3b8f0c89 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Wasn't there (pardon me) a "Source", that supplied Viton cups for the
accelerator pumps. Are these still available? Would Viton be better resistant to
the Ethanol in the gas? I'm no chemist, but ethanol works the same way on
me!
- Seth
In a message dated 8/30/2011 4:34:35 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
hmlinc at sbcglobal.net writes:
You bought old stock rubber that was already partially deteriorated OR
there
IS ethanol in your gasoline?
You said - 3 times - but you did not say over what time period. Those of
us
in ethanol states (most now) are changing accelerator pump cups (new
rubber)
every 2 to 3 years.
Later, JR
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2011 00:18:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: Sethracer at aol.com
Subject: <VV> Replacement Blocks & engines
To: hmlinc at sbcglobal.net, virtualvairs at corvair.org
Message-ID: <157ce.1d023929.3b8f1026 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
JR - I think he got a regular installed engine, (hence the stamping) but
the castings for the case halves (Actually, only the passenger side half)
was made to be universal - able to be finished as an FC (filler tube boss)
standard (boss for dipstick) or even an early, with the lower mounted oil
boss (temp?). They could machine it to the finished part they needed. The
replacement assembled engines had a freeze plug in the filler tube boss in the
right case half, which could be removed for an FC application, no
machining needed. And I do think those were stamped XX or something similar. - Seth
In a message dated 8/30/2011 6:57:31 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
hmlinc at sbcglobal.net writes:
I thought that crate engines were stamped with some XXs - not a full block
#.
Later, JR
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 2011 23:57:54 -0500
From: "J R Read" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>
Subject: <VV> viton pump cups
To: <Sethracer at aol.com>, <dpleau at wavecable.com>,
<virtualvairs at corvair.org>
Message-ID: <CDCF23C84AF742459DF895905C09A970 at OFFICEDELL>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Hi Seth,
Yes, IIRC there was a source - not sure if it was "The Source" (AKA David
H.) that had viton pump cups available. Someone will likely let us know on
that point.
Further, and again IIRC, it seems to me that there were some questions about
using viton in this application. They went along the lines of - potential
greater wear on metal components of the carb.... viton resists heat better
than neoprene (or whatever they are made of today - the black ones), but is
heat the problem in this application...... is viton more or less resistant
to modern gas than the current black stuff.....
I do not know the answers to any of the things above and I do not know what
(black VS brownish) substance goes into modern pump cups. I'm hoping for
something (like modern 'rubber' fuel line) which is at least resistant to
the alcohol in the gas, but I simply do not know the answers here. I'm also
hoping for a material that does not wear out the carbs rapidly.
Perhaps someone else on VV has looked into this more deeply than I and can
provide some appropriate suggestions.
Perhaps you would like to participate in a genetic experiment since you
already know the effect of alcohol on your body?
>GGGG>
Later, JR
CCE CORSA CORVANANTICS SCG member
'61 Rampside Standard 4/110
'65 Monza Convertible 4/140
"Keep the Love Alive"
----- Original Message -----
From: <Sethracer at aol.com>
To: <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>; <dpleau at wavecable.com>;
<virtualvairs at corvair.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 30, 2011 11:03 PM
Subject: Re: <VV> FW: corvair carburetors - pump cups
> Wasn't there (pardon me) a "Source", that supplied Viton cups for the
> accelerator pumps. Are these still available? Would Viton be better
> resistant to
> the Ethanol in the gas? I'm no chemist, but ethanol works the same way on
> me!
>
> - Seth
>
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2011 06:19:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: N2VZD at aol.com
Subject: Re: <VV> FROZEN MOTORs
To: virtualvairs at corvair.org
Message-ID: <5801a.6dd94422.3b8f64b3 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
the wrist pins are a very sticky point for frozen motors. sometimes they
do more to hold things back than the rings / pistons to cylinders. Squirt
a lot of blaster in there , and in each cylinder. squirt it around the top
and bottom of the cylinders . wait a few days for it to migrate. i will be
doing the exact same thing to 2 motors soon , a 66 95hp , and a 64
greenbrier 110hp that are very rusty. in fact this greenbrier i am parting out
(in my spare? time ) is the rustiest vehicle i have ever parted out. even
the transmission case is looking very bad.it is a bundle of white corrosion
under there .I recently bought a harbor freight blowtorch designed to use
on a propane tank for shrink wrapping boats , hoping to heat the heads on
some of the bad motors i have. maybe that big flame will help. I will be
jacking it up , and removing the powertrain soon. i have never seen a corvair
so rusty , that the forward motor mounts fell out of the crossmember , and
the axles are all that hold the motor in...and only 53,000 miles on it. i
hope (small chance) the bearings and gears in the differential survived. front
steering linkage looks good so far. i will be posting pictures of this
project on the
cnycorvair.com website soon.
regards, Tim Colson playing junkyard dog again soon
------------------------------
Message: 8
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2011 07:49:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mikeamauro at aol.com
Subject: Re: <VV> WTB: '65 FC (Greenbrier) 110 Block
To: virtualvairs at corvair.org
Message-ID: <39ef0.632a5811.3b8f79df at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
"...I've got what I was told is a replacement block in a 61 Rampside
thatdoesn't have anything stamped on it. The pad is devoid of anything. Though
someone who is knowledgeable had a look and said it was set up as a
61...Mike Clark...Stockbridge, Georgia."
The block is what was termed a Universal Replacement Block (not a crate
engine). Universal Replacement Blocks were offered for either car or FC use
(hence the hole for the rear, FC-use, oil filler spout. If used in a car,
the FC oil filler spout hole was typically plugged (by the user) with a freeze
plug. Also, the pad for the block ID numbers was left blank; and, if
desired, the installer/owner could stamp in the numbers of the removed,
original block (this is what I did with my, since sold, 64 Spyder).
Mike Mauro
------------------------------
Message: 9
Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2011 08:16:13 -0400
From: Jay Pitchford <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: <VV> Prayers Needed
To: Virtual Vairs <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
Message-ID:
<CAOHtzBCzYW0tBgMXbN1Veo6gKuaxzZDjHn=LLigezsn-+DD4GA at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Update from Tracy this morning:
UPDATE ON MICHAEL'S SON: He slept through the night and was able to get off
of morphine pump and take actual pain pills.....lite diet...jello....got
moved to regular room last eve. Talked/joked all day....guess this is ONE
time a parent can be grateful to have a "HARDHEADED" teenager! Thanks to
everyone for the support and prayers!
****************************************************************************
On Tue, Aug 30, 2011 at 5:21 PM, Jay Pitchford <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>wrote:
> Update from Tracy:
>
> He's got a fractured clavicle and skull. Gonna be a long recovery for him.
> They did take the neck brace off this am and no more swelling or changes
> since 3:30am. He will move out of ICU this afternoon if he continues to
> improve.
>
> Jay Pitchford
>
------------------------------
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