<VV> Reply... Subject: 64 Wagon

[Bill Hubbell]

See, Mark, that's the problem - you just don't get it.  Once you build
something that GM never made, all claims of Stock become irrelevant.  Smitty
has as much right to claim his car is a "Stock 1964 Corvair Wagon" as you
have to claim you had a "1969 Corsa" or that you will have a "Late model
Corvair Wagon".  Since they are ALL Custom jobs it is up to the restorer to
decide how they should look, and it is not up to you or I to claim
otherwise.

Smitty built the "1964 Wagon" the way he knew GM would have built it for
him, just as you are building your cars the way you "know" GM would have
built them.

The purists (and I am one of them) will always be correct in calling these
cars modified.  But then, Smitty never tried to enter his car in Concours as
"factory stock" or even as "street stock".  He did enter it in Concours,
though, and it did eventually get called the "64 wagon"  It has earned that
right, just as the builder of a Corvair "El Corvino" has earned the right to
call his car that.  

If Smitty then wants to talk about the handling characteristics of "the '64
wagon" in autocrossing, or the unique problems of releasing the exhaust from
the side of the car in the '64 wagon, he has earned that right as well.
Regardless of whether you like the paint color, the interior upholstery
(which he makes himself, by the way), or the fender skirts (also custom made
by Smitty), he can still say that those things were "standard" on the '64
wagon because they ARE standard on his car - just like helicopter blades are
standard on all Corvair helicopters.

In the long run, Mark, you are rendering your opinion that you do not like
the look of the '64 wagon because you imagined that a '64 wagon should look
more like a '64 Sedan, coupe or convertible.  Sorry to disappoint you, Mark,
but that's NOT the way GM built the '64 wagons (and you can't prove me
wrong, either).

Bill

-----Original Message-----
From: airvair at earthlink.net [mailto:airvair at earthlink.net] 
Sent: Friday, November 27, 2009 5:03 PM
To: whubbell at umich.edu; BBRT; Smitty Smith
Cc: virtualvairs at corvair.org
Subject: RE: <VV> Reply... Subject: 64 Wagon

Well Bill, you could also say that I had a '69 Corsa. But then, the purists
have had a hissy fit over that one for decades. The difference is that my
'69 Corsa was pure stock. No custom paint job, no custom upholstery, no
aftermarket fender skirts (and fender skirts were ALWAYS aftermarket on a
Corvair - never "factory stock" by any means.) It was as pure stock as you
could get, even down to the laquer paint color.

While the factory DID offer tutone paint, they NEVER broke it up like
what's on Smitty's car, and without a doubt wouldn't ever have done so
(unless maybe you were buying a phone company car, or the like.) Nor did
they offer upholstery on Corvairs that matched the kind of fabric and
assembly variation that Smitty's car has. Regardless, any way you slice it,
is certainly more gaudy than any Corvair the factory ever built in any
large quantity. And it looks like the custom car that it is. You of anyone
should know that it isn't "stock" enough to be called that.

And in the vein of the '69 Corsa, my LM wagon will be closer to stock than
Smitty's car, guaranteed. It'll have the stock paint layout, stock
upholstery pattern, even a more stock overall look. So the fact that they
didn't build that body style that year is irrelevant. What IS the point is
that sooner or later one WILL exist. It exists now, just that the bodywork
isn't completed yet. Would you say a car that hasn't had the restoration
bodywork completed doesn't exist?

And in case you doubt that I don't admire Smitty for his efforts at a
custom EM, think again. Anyone who has rebuilt/restored a car has my
admiration. He's done a great job, and I especially admire his driving it
all over creation. But I'm calling a spade a spade, and calling Smitty's
car exactly what it is, a custom car. No disrespect intended whatsoever.

Get over it.

-Mark


> [Original Message]
> From: Bill Hubbell <whubbell at cox.net>
> Subject: RE: <VV> Reply... Subject: 64 Wagon
>
> Mark is making an absurd argument.  First of all, no matter what Mark does
> to "imagineer" a Late Model station wagon, it will always be a more
> fictional vehicle than Smitty's "64" wagon for the following reasons:
>
> 1. GM actually did make EM wagons and Smitty's wagon body is pure stock in
> that regard; Mark's won't be by any stretch.
>
> 2. GM actually did offer two-tone paint for EM vehicles, and, although
> Smitty's colors are not Factory Stock, who is to say that they would not
> have been if a '64 wagon had been made?  It was also possible to get
> 'custom' paint jobs from the factory, and I suspect that had wagons been
> available in 1964 this would have been a probable choice.
>
> 3. There actually were some EM Corvairs (1961) that came with cloth/vinyl
> seats (much like Smitty's wagon, although, again, not in that color).
>
> 4. Wheel skirts were already an option for EM sedans and coupes.  It is
> probable that they would have been available for wagons had they been made
> beyond 1962, so the fact that a '64 wagon would have them is perfectly
> plausible.
>
> Bottom line, Mark, Smitty's '64 wagon IS a reality (and has been ever
since
> it was built in 1989).  For 20 years it has been plying the highways and
> byways of this great country, logging over 300,000 miles (most of which
> pulling a trailer or some other such thing) and generally showing the
world
> exactly how BIG a mistake GM made by NOT making more of them.  It has been
> an ambassador of Goodwill for ALL Corvairs for longer than many VV readers
> have even OWNED a Corvair.  It's value to our Corvair community has been
> validated by awards too many to count, including Senior Class Concours,
> numerous 1st place Autocross awards, etc.  It has earned our RESPECT and
> ADMIRATION.
>
> Live with it.
>
> Bill